I’m posting this blog entry mainly to solicit feedback on a major dilemma that I now find myself facing, with regard to the development of Sanctum of the Archmage II. That dilemma is whether to continue with my decision to develop the first act of the sequel in Neverwinter Nights 2, or to go back to developing it in Neverwinter Nights 1.
I was initially very impressed with Neverwinter Nights 2 in January when I got my new computer and played through the OC. I was wildly enthusiastic about the possibility of scripting with parameters (those of you who don’t code, trust me: that’s a big deal), with the improved graphics and terrain modeling, and with many of the design improvements that I saw in the engine. And since it seemed to me that the future of Neverwinter Nights lay in the sequel, rather than in NWN1, I decided that making the switch early would be a good idea.
I also heard (and saw, as I started trying to learn it) a great deal about the instability of the toolset. I was horrified at the almost uniformly grotesque head models, the full-body underwear, and the elimination of 2D portraits and cinematic cutscenes. Many of the armor models had bizarre hard-coded tints that could not be changed in the toolset. And the initial palette of creatures and models did seem a bit light. But I also knew that I wasn’t going to be able to get to work in earnest on Sanctum II until May or so because of my schedule. And by then, I reasoned, most of these issues would have started to be addressed and new and custom content would start appearing for the game. In the meantime I could work on planning, and on fully fleshing out the plot for the three acts of the sequel.
Now that May is here (indeed, almost over) and that planning work is done, I’ve had to take a sober look at these expectations. And what I’ve seen hasn’t given me a sense of confidence about the prospect of being able to build the first act of Sanctum II in NWN2 — not in a way that I will be satisfied with as a builder.
The NWN2 toolset seems to be crashing less than when I first started using it, but there are still widespread bugs. For example, the item-related 2DA files have actually spawned a whole host of “Bad Strref” entries since the 1.04 patch. I haven’t lost any work due to corrupted mod files, thank goodness, but I’m still seeing posts from other builders who are reporting this. And unless I’m completely confused about where to to look, the NWN2 models sections of the vault show next to nothing in the way of new creature and placeable content. This was a huge surprise to me, since NWN1 had a robust community of modelers (such as the CEP Team) that were regularly developing such resources for the game.
After doing some digging this morning, though, I think I’m beginning to understand some of the reasons for this. Apparently, Obsidian used a proprietary 3D modeling and animation system for NWN2 called “Granny.” From what I’ve been able to gather, Granny offered certain benefits in terms of performance and ease of development — but at the price of a proprietary format for which there are no available converters for commonly used modeling programs like 3DSMax. A prospective modeler could, of course, buy a copy of Granny — starting, I believe, at around $12,500 for a single machine license. Perhaps not surprisingly, that hasn’t turned out to be a particularly viable option for the cadre of amateur 3D modelers who had previously been turning out so much excellent work for the Neverwinter Nights community.
As a result, and from what I can see, there are few to no new creature and placeable models for NWN2, even now eight months after release of the game and much longer after the appearance of the pre-release toolset. There has been widespread clamor for a “granny plugin” from Obsidian that will finally make this modeling work possible, and they appear to be working hard to provide one in the relatively near future. If it works well, that will be a real breakthrough that should liberate and empower custom modelers to start creating new models for NWN2.
But that work will almost certainly come too late for me to make any use of for Sanctum II, Act I, since I have to start making progress on the sequel now. And this has put me in something of bind with regard to some of the content that I need to make Act I work. Wasting half a day today unsuccessfully trying just to re-create the “Control Rod” from Sanctum I — a simple, unadorned black rod held in the left hand — brought me up short about the harsh realities of this. Here’s a partial list of the creatures and models that I want or need for the sequel that I currently cannot find or create in NWN2:
– The Beastmen. They return and play an important role in Sanctum II, Act I. The closest thing I can find to them in the NWN2 toolset are bugbears.
– Hand-held wands and rods. The player acquired several of these in Chapter 1. None of the wand or rod models from NWN1 seem to have made it into NWN2.
– Demons. Demons play a central role in Sanctum of the Archmage, and not surprisingly, there are a number of major battles with them in Sanctum II. NWN1 and CEP between them gave a wide selection of fiendish outsider models to choose from. NWN2, by contrast, has Balor, a Hezrou, a Succubus, and a couple of devils. I could probably make do with these, but that isn’t a whole lot of variety from which to construct an army of demons that are overrunning the kingdom.
– Pegasi. The elven pegasus warriors play an important role throughout all three acts of Sanctum II. From what I can gather, there aren’t even any horses available in NWN2, much less winged ones.
For these reasons and others, I’m now seriously considering returning to building in NWN1 until NWN2 matures more as a modding environment. There is no question that the development of Sanctum II Act I will go much faster if I do this, even if it does mean scrapping much of the preliminary work that I’ve already done in the NWN2 toolset. And I could always port Act I to NWN2 later on. I really would rather move to NWN2 now, but I can’t shake the conviction that the considerations I’ve described here are too important to set aside and just “hope for the best” by sticking with NWN2, at least for the first act. (As a former manager of mine used to put it: “Hope is not a course of action.”)
This is a decision I have to make now. So the question I wanted to solicit feedback from my fellow players and builders on is: what do you think? Am I overreacting, and are the prospects for NWN2 maturing sufficiently in the couple of months or so better than my currently pessimistic mood would indicate? Or would going back to NWN1 be a sober decision based on an assessment of the current realities of modding with NWN2?
I would be sorely disappointed if you took this mod off NWN, as I cannot get NWN2 and I really loved the first chapter.
Getting NWN2 would require me to buy a new computer and I cannot afford that and I don’t really see myself being able to for quite some time. I have friends who have played NWN2 and have given me some pretty bad feedback on it which makes me really iffy on even considering getting it in the first place.
I didn’t know that this was an issue before/during playing this mod but when I finished and was all psyched for the next one and went on the vault to see if it was out and found that it upset me greatly.
Most of the really good builders are jumping ship and it stinks for those of us that cannot/will not get NWN2.
I saw your posts on the forum and the vault and I noticed that no one was responding who wasn’t a mod builder, so here’s my two cents from the player camp!
PLEASE don’t build it in NWN2!
Pretty please?
I would really like to see the mod in nwn2 but if building it in nwn feels right for you then do that. I will play it either way. I am working on a mod in nwn2 myself and so far haven’t run into any issues with the toolset.
SaintMischief: thank you very much for your wonderful comments! You’re reminding me of something that I should take care not to forget: that I’m really building Sanctum II for the players and fans of Sanctum I. It’s a continuation of a saga that started in NWN1 and the sequel won’t stand on its own. It’s not meant to be played by anyone who hasn’t played the first chapter, or at the very least read the synopsis I’ll be writing to accompany it. So by moving to NWN2, I would be restricting my audience to NWN1 players who’ve moved to NWN2. I don’t like to feel that I would be turning my back on fans of the saga who aren’t ready to do that.
If time weren’t such an issue for me, the best solution would be to build Act I in NWN1 this summer and then port it over to NWN2 this fall. That would give NWN2 some time to mature, and still give fans and players of chapter one the first part of the sequel. And since Chapter 2, Act I will finish where I had originally planned for Chapter 1 to end, it will feel like a more settled ending. The demands of my “real life,” though, would make that dual-development effort problematic at best.
In any event I really appreciate your kind words about the saga. It means a lot to me that Sanctum I has earned fans who feel so strongly about wanting to play the sequel. Thank you!
Personally, I would prefer the module to be built in NWN1, so that I could import the character I used in the first mod. I feel that if I had to create another character with NWN 2 to continue the story, it just wouldn’t feel the same.
But whatever you decide, you will have my support and I will defenitely be playing this sequel!
All,
Thanks for the feedback. As I explain on my website, my plan for Sanctum II was to do a campaign of three short modules or “Acts” for NWN2. The overall campaign would be titled “Sanctum of the Archmage II: The Miracle Worker,” and the first act of it was going to be titled “The Alliance.”
I still want to take more time to make a final decision about what to do. Right now, though, I’m leaning toward doing the first act of the sequel in NWN1, and then switching to NWN2 to do the two follow-on “acts.” The break between Acts 1 and 2 is in some respects cleaner than the one between “The Sight” and Act 1, so that might be a better point in the story to switch engines. And I won’t be able to work on the second act until early next year anyway. That would give NWN2 more time to mature and player systems more time to catch up with its demanding hardware requirements.
Does anyone have any thoughts or feedback on that approach?
I played NWN2 and fiddled with the toolset. Simple things are harder now, placeables are tedious, character heads are goofy and you can’t just ignore it and look at a pretty picture. Plus, Male!Robin will be shorter than the (recommended) human protagonist. (Look, I’m petty and I care.)
NWN2 has also had mysterious slowdowns and general weirdness for me and I have a new system with bells /and/ whistles that really shouldn’t have the same problems my old one did. Add still unfixed bugs and ugly model heads, I am unsatisfied with NWN2.
NWN isn’t perfect and will look blocky and weird now that I’ve seen the lovely trees of NWN2, but I’ll get over it. A story with the right monsters and an array of proper demons means more than pretty shrubs.
I’d give it time. NWN2 will get better mod-wise, like NWN did (pleasepleaseplease). That writ, I’ll play either, though. I really /really/ want to know what happens next.
PS. Starting a new character vs. importing is irrelevant to me. A new engine/model/picture/class/whatever, for me, they are who I say they are. 🙂
It’s depressing, the choices they made with NWN2. I wish they would have thought more about it. Seems silly to me. I’m sure they had their reasons, but the result is a lack of ability to do the kind of custom content we want.
And if you’ll notice me ranting elsewhere, I dislike the heads that ship with the game, and there aren’t many alternatives. The male heads are especially ugly, in my opinion, but even, say, the female gnome and female halfling heads are rather nightmarish. I don’t mind creating ugly characters, but gosh, sometimes I want to create a pretty one. Especially if it’s a “cute” little halfling.
Not to mention most of the heads are old looking. None of the human male heads look a day under 30. Age is totally relative, but that should be something to argue in favor of some younger-looking heads. I don’t wanna play as an old man, especially when my character is 18!
Anyway, blah blah blah. I just think it’s lame, and I thought this Granny 3D Exporter might help, but jeez, they expect people to have $13,000 licenses, or do they expect everyone to pirate it?
Silly.
Hey Jesse,
Thanks for your comments. One thing about the Granny plugin: if I’m understanding things correctly, the plugin is what will alleviate the need to spend $13k on the main program. It will be a converter for 3DSMax (which you can get for a lot less, and which many custom CC builders already have), so that you don’t have to buy a copy of Granny to build models that can be used in NWN2.
I have to be honest (and yes, I’m late to the party), I am relieved you have decided to build the second part in NWN2. My machine can’t handle NWN2 right now without crying and I don’t have the resources to upgrade. I was very unhappy when I thought I wouldn’t get to play the second part. (NWN2 is just too painful for me.) Thank you for this news.